Comments for Egyptological

Comment on Early Dynastic Baboon Figurines by Sarah Preece by David Caldecoat

David Caldecoat — Wed, 22 Feb 2012 22:16:42 +0000

these sure have a lot of detail left on them no matter how old the are and they look funny as well.
grate photos.

Comment on Paneb – “The All Round Bad Guy” by Khazar-khum

Khazar-khum — Tue, 21 Feb 2012 15:42:40 +0000

Jealousy, infidelity, bickering, fighting, sex, drinking–isn’t this called “Jersey Shore”?

Comment on Islamic items from Egypt in the Tareq Ragab Museum, Kuwait. By Barbara O’Neill by Kate

Kate — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 22:39:44 +0000

The styling just looked so similar to Coptic items in the British Museum. I suspect the design was in use for a millenium or more so it probably depends on provenance, which is why I asked.

Comment on Ethnic origin of Ramesses I? by Rafi Epand

Rafi Epand — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 22:37:24 +0000

1) I think A4 or Akhenaten was quite vigorous. He closed down Karnak, he made up his own religion, and he moved the capitol of Egypt and built an entire city on a ‘greenfield’ site. How much more does a Pharaoh have to do to be called vigorous?
2) Everybody calls R2 the “great”. Well he had the luck of good health. If you live long, it is easy to accomplish a lot. If he died in the battle with the Hittites, which everybody says he lost badly, would he still be called ‘great’? Don’t forget the mortality rate in AE was very high. (For example: evidently Tut just needed an open fracture to kill him at 17.) Was Tut not vigorous? Or maybe they had no antibiotics?
3) Egyptian art depicts ideas and concepts that are not entirely clear today. Akhenaten more likely than not depicted himself and his family in a style closer to what ancient Egyptians though the creator gods looked like. This is iconography. R2’s divine birth, and every other pharaoh who has done this, Hatshepsut comes to mind now, is just religious/political propaganda, nothing more. To understand AE art, you must think how you transmit ideas to basically an illiterate population.
4) Most of the art we have come from funerary settings or Karnak. Karnak was pure propaganda to show how the gods fought great battles for their sons. Does A4 not look vigorous here at Pylon III at Karnak:
http://dlib.etc.ucla.edu/projects/Karnak/assets/media/resources/PylonIII/highres/DSCN0106ww20.jpg

Note: comment edited – Kate Phizackerley

Comment on Islamic items from Egypt in the Tareq Ragab Museum, Kuwait. By Barbara O’Neill by Barbara

Barbara — Wed, 15 Feb 2012 05:00:34 +0000

I really don’t know. I have asked an Arabic speaker to look at it closely and she cannot distinguish Islamic calligraphy, although it does look like Islamic patterning on the upper detail. I’m interested though, in why it might appear coptic?

Comment on Islamic items from Egypt in the Tareq Ragab Museum, Kuwait. By Barbara O’Neill by Kate

Kate — Tue, 14 Feb 2012 23:43:52 +0000

I do wonder whether the oil lamp might be Coptic rather than Fatimid. How secure are the provenances?

I do really like the bronze bird btw.
Kate

Comment on Islamic items from Egypt in the Tareq Ragab Museum, Kuwait. By Barbara O’Neill by Barbara

Barbara — Tue, 14 Feb 2012 19:22:57 +0000

He has bags of character, that’s for sure Andie and surprisingly large, which you can’t really tell from the image – perhaps 18″ tall, maybe a bit more, so a substantial piece. I love the birds.

Comment on Ethnic origin of Ramesses I? by Brian Alm

Brian Alm — Tue, 14 Feb 2012 15:21:10 +0000

I think you could make a plausible case on circumstantial evidence: Hyksos were Asiatic, Asians from Canaan had been emigrating into the Delta for 400 or more years before them, so there was plenty of Asian blood in the gene pool around there, the Hyksos themselves were military people and so were the Ramesside family (starting with RamI, a general), so maybe there was some transfer of knowledge, inclination or will involved there, RamII may have had red hair, the same as Seth, etc. The time that had elapsed since the Hyksos is not a problem, it seems to me: all the more time for genes to get mixed, and the Ramesside family was not originally royal — they could have taken up with whomever they pleased. Also no problem with the name Seth because Seth was not reviled in that area but revered for his strength, power, etc., and for protecting Ra from Apep during the nightly voyage, hence the names in that family based on Seth, e.g., RamI’s son/RamII’s father, Seti I. Of course, it was a different story in Thebes: witness Seti II’s nomen cartouches in the barque station at Karnak, all with the Seth part chiseled out. But in the eastern Delta, Seth was big. The fact that the last of the Hyksos was named Apepi also seems indicative of a sort of blending of otherwise unsavory bedfellows, so maybe that sort of thing was in the drinking water there or something.

In any case, I agree with everyone else: an interesting idea and not outlandish, to my way of thinking.

Comment on Ethnic origin of Ramesses I? by Derek Martin

Derek Martin — Tue, 14 Feb 2012 12:53:13 +0000

Thanks Dylan, Marie, Jean and Gwyneth for your input.
I had reasoned, that it was the infusion of fresh blood to an insulated race that might have produced the surge of energy, but I couldn’t agree more about the same effect being produced by getting away from the Amarna family
I’m bound to admit, Marie, that quite a lot of time had elapsed since the expulsion of the Hyksos, so perhaps I am guilty of placing too much emphasis on these Asiatics alone.
It does seem odd though that if Set was still regarded as a basically evil God, that his name was still in vogue in the Delta area at that late time, don’t you think? Derek

Comment on Islamic items from Egypt in the Tareq Ragab Museum, Kuwait. By Barbara O’Neill by Andie

Andie — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 21:49:13 +0000

I absolutely love the Fatimid lion, Barbara.

Comment on Ethnic origin of Ramesses I? by Gwyneth Ashworth-Pratt

Gwyneth Ashworth-Pratt — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 16:04:08 +0000

Thanks everyone – having just tried to research a little about Ramese II’s “divine birth” and found he and his immediate predecessors had tenuous attachments to royalty / royal line, I have found this very interesting and will appendage it to my notes.

Comment on Ethnic origin of Ramesses I? by Jean

Jean — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 16:00:22 +0000

Based on no evidence whatsoever I do believe it very possible Rameses I was of ‘Asiatic’ descent – although not necessarily related to the ‘Hekau Khasut’ [Hyksos].

Comment on Ethnic origin of Ramesses I? by Dylan Bickerstaffe

Dylan Bickerstaffe — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 15:56:32 +0000

I think Marie makes some good points, but my take is slightly different. Asiatics (which rather than Hyksos per se is what we are talking about) had been becoming numerous in the Delta region since at least the First Intermediate Period. Fresh waves arrived periodically, and The Hyksos were probably one such in the Second Intermediate Period. Asiatics undoubtedly continued to appear in the Delta region and Asiatic high officials of state were probably common in the later 18th Dynasty (as with Aper El?) as was certainly the case in the 19th and 20th Dynasties.
It is not unlikely, therefore, that the Seti/Ramesses family had quite a bit of Asiatic blood. The worship of Seth might be significant in this.
Ramesses II might have had red hair, which could be an indicator. Like Marie, I would not necessarily equate vigour with Hyksos, and the big build of the Ramessides might rather be a reflection of the fact that they were military men.

Comment on Ethnic origin of Ramesses I? by Marie A Parsons

Marie A Parsons — Mon, 13 Feb 2012 13:26:53 +0000

Hi Derek (and Andie),

Interesting question, more so for me because I am quite fascinated by the first handful of Ramesside kings.

According to Kathryn Bard’s _Encyclopedia of the Archaeology of Ancient Egypt_, Avaris, was taken by Ahmose, founder of the 18th dynasty. She goes on to say that Josephus reported that the inhabitants of Avaris all retreated to Palestine after the siege. The town remained deserted until the 19th dynasty, except for two areas: the temple of Seth, which continued to be used, as was the former citadel. The palace was razed to the ground and rebuilt during the early 18th dynasty and it became an army headquarters. Arrowheads of bone and flint, and household pottery of the Nubian Kerma culture, were found there as well Seti I and Ramesses II constructed the new residence of Pi Ramesses about 2 kms north of Avaris.

I am wondering if “Hyksos” meant much, by the time Ramesses I served in the army with Horemheb. That is after all quite some decades later. Horemheb’s ancestry is also not known, except that he may have come from near the Faiyum, not too far off. But between the 18th and 19th dynasties, intermarriages may have made “hyksos” an irrelevant term by that time. Is it conceivable that just being outside of the AmenhotepIII/Amarna genetic line might have been enough for that new vigor? Perhaps there were some Syro-Palestinians still living in that area of the delta–but also, perhaps intermarriages over the years made that distinction superfluous.

Still an interesting question.

Comment on Notes on the Goddess Pakhet by Andie

Andie — Sun, 12 Feb 2012 15:35:12 +0000

Hello Jane

I would be most interested in learning your reasons for thinking that Menhit/Menhur was recognized in the prehistoric/Predynastic? I cannot recall having seen any iconography that would relate to a specific feline deity.

I am sorry that I can’t shed any light on the subject, but look forward to reading your findings when your research is completed.

Kind regards
Andrea

Comment on The Granite Plugs of the Great Pyramid by Femano

Femano — Tue, 07 Feb 2012 14:35:15 +0000

Thanks for that thoughtful comment, Pat. I, too, strongly believe the Grand Gallery served an important and tangible, not symbolic, function. It may very well be that the gallery was used as a freight elevator for the massive blocks up there as Houdin suggests, but I’m tending to doubt his portrayal for many reasons, including the following:

- the fact that Gallery stops at the bottom floor instead of the top floor of the relieving chambers. How were the granite slabs raised to the upper levels of the relieving chambers?

- why place the King’s Chamber so close to the Gallery so that the relieving chambers are even required at all? Why not place the Gallery farther north (or the King’s Chamber farther south) to preclude the need for the relieving chambers?

- the purpose of the enigmatic features within the Antechamber (not addressed in Houdin’s “One man’s obsession” book).

- the small surface area allowed for wooden rollers would vaporize the wood with the weight of those massive granite blocks.

- where is the evidence of a tow ramp on the other side of the pyramid?

- what logistics and engineering were required to reset the ca. 15 separate granite counterweight blocks, each weighing 5 tons?

- pulleys had not yet been invented in the 4th Dynasty.

- what kind of rope set could pull 80 tons up a 50% incline while overcoming the associated friction?

- how were the blocks lifted to the level of the northern end of the Gallery?

- much more lubricant would be required than the amount indicated in the “stain” reported by Houdin; why haven’t samples of that stain been carbon dated yet?

- the so-called rope groove in the Great Step is too asymmetric and too far off-center.

- the geometry of the slots in the benches is overly complex and unsuited to serve merely as anchors for wooden guides/ratchets.

The list goes on and on. Houdin does a good job cherry-picking details that support his theory while discarding other evidence that contradicts his theory. But I do give him enormous credit for being creative and thinking out of the box. We need more of that.

Comment on The Granite Plugs of the Great Pyramid by timothy hart

timothy hart — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 16:47:27 +0000

It is a water-collor etching/pressed print of the measurements of the Great pyramid, with 32 diagrams and 4 drawings out of Morton Edgars Books, with a full view layover of the Shaft and tunnel system of the Giza Pyramid. It is believed to be a ONE of a kind print with maybe one other in existence.

Comment on The Granite Plugs of the Great Pyramid by timothy hart

timothy hart — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 16:41:08 +0000

I have a Morton Edgar Print I am trying to find information on. Any Idea who I could ask about it ?

Comment on Help researching Ankhesenamum by Khazar-khum

Khazar-khum — Sun, 05 Feb 2012 03:47:36 +0000

If you are going to study Ankhesenamun, you’ll have to grapple with the recent DNA tests. It would be interesting if someone could explain why the women from KV21 were included in the survey.

Comment on The Granite Plugs of the Great Pyramid by Pat Mowatt

Pat Mowatt — Sat, 04 Feb 2012 01:37:45 +0000

Excellent article.

I am very much an amateur in Pyramid lore, having become interested in the subject as a result of watching the National Geographic presentation of JP Houdin’s “internal ramp” construction theory. From a layman’s perspective, given the internal layout of the Great Pyramid, it seems obvious that the Grand Gallery was a “functional” component of the construction process. While I do not necessarily agree with Mr. Houdin’s conceptual “trolley/ counterweight” system, I do believe that the Grand Gallery was essential for raising the largest granite blocks for the King’s Chamber/ relieving chambers.

Having said that, I offer the view that perhaps the “plugs” were put into place immediately following the construction of these internal features. The function of the Grand Gallery had at that point been fulfilled; and access to the King’s Chamber was still available, as the entire construction project had not yet been completed- perhaps construction was even halted at this point to await the death of Khufu. If so, the granite plugs and “cosmetic” Prism stone served as a temporary security feature, barring access, but were never intended to stay the efforts of determined plunders in the distant future.

Comments, or your own thoughts about the Houdin theory, would be much appreciated.

Pat